Hours Of Service - What Would Be Perfect In Your Opinion?

Mike

Well-Known Member
Staff member
And the answer can't be simply to eliminate them. :)

Trying to keep safety in mind, and realizing the fact that we are going to be regulated in regards to how much we can drive, what would you like to see?

I can't pin this down perfectly, but here is a brief overview of what I would like to see, and I don't know that many here will agree with it upon first look. :).

This is simple, and to the point.

10 hours on duty total per day (midnight to midnight). I don't think any person should have to work more than this.

After 10 hours of on duty time, you must have at least a 5 hour break. This eliminates a driver possibly being overworked in a couple scenarios.
  • Once you have 10 hours of on duty time, without a full 5 hour break, you must take 5 hours off. In other words, if it is 11:00pm when you hit your 10 hours, you must shut down until at least 4:00am. At that point, you have 10 more hours you can run that day, and if you do it immediately (4:00 am to 2:00 pm), you cannot run the rest of the day until after midnight.
And once this is put in place, I would want all drivers to adhere to it, without fudging their logbooks. This would allow you to get your 10 hours of work in pretty much however you see fit throughout the day, eliminates the 14 hour clock, and prevents drivers from being worked too hard.

Why I like this:
The answer to making more money is not getting more miles. The answer is getting more money for the miles that you drive. If everyone was to drive like this, freight rates come up, pay per mile goes up, and shipper/receivers lose the leverage of pushing us to make insane appointment times.

A 10 hour day of work, leaves 14 hours for:
8 hours sleep
3 hours for meals and a shower
3 hours for various breaks and leisure time.

But it only works if the majority run legal under this system.

Ok, there is mine, what is yours?
 

pja1965

Life is a race
problem

The problem with this is for local and reganal drivers as myself. I work 2 days of 1 work 2 days off 2. If this came into play I would work 6 and off 1. They need to seperate HOS between OTR and local,reganal. I would drive 1000 miles and have 15 stops or more. The 10 houre day rule would suck!
 

Mike

Well-Known Member
Staff member
The problem with this is for local and reganal drivers as myself. I work 2 days of 1 work 2 days off 2. If this came into play I would work 6 and off 1. They need to seperate HOS between OTR and local,reganal. I would drive 1000 miles and have 15 stops or more. The 10 houre day rule would suck!
I just gave my idea, would love to hear yours.

As for the 10 hour per day rule not being good for you though, why do you want to work more than this? The whole point of this when I stated it is for everyone to do it, forcing the rates that we get paid to be raised.

In other words, make them pay you more for your stops, allowing you to make a good wage, but still not working more than 10 hours per day. Doesn't matter what kind of driving you do, you still shouldn't have to work more than 10 hours per day to make a good living.

I think the biggest mistake that drivers can make is pushing for more hours to drive, when they should be pushing to get paid more for what they already do.
 

gearjammer

jammer
Supporter
I see nothing wrong with the 11 hours of driving, I do have a problem with the CONTINUOUS 14 hour rule though since it forces you to drive as hard and long as you can,no stopping for a decent meal,restroom breaks are done at a run, you cannot stop for a power nap,its just plain not safe, the ten hours off was a godsend for the company drivers because they cannot be forced by the dispatchers to run without adequate sleep they now can eat, do what the need to do and still get a good nights rest, the 34 hr.reset why is it 34? a 24 hour reset is long enough for anyone to get rested up and it would keep you closer to driving at the same time each day which is what the sleep experts were complaining about
 

Diamondtim

New Member
What I do not like is when I am regulated to 14 hours, wether driving, or on-duty not driving, then I get to a shipper, or reciever, on time or early mind you, and I am told I have to wait until they are ready for me. What is the point of having appointments if they cannot keep them. I bet if I was to be a little late then they would be all over me for being late, even though they are not ready.

Any way, when this happens, it eats away at my time, and limits how much driving I can do after they are finally done. I believe that once we pull into a shipping or recieving area, that if they are not ready, then we switch to an hourly rate, like what ever we make per mile times 55 or 60 MPH, which is what we would make if driving, as long as we show we were on time. Then the freight companies should charge the hourly rates to the shippers or recievers since it is their fault I have to sit there. This is better than the layover pay, since in most cases you have to be sitting for a set length of time before layover pay even begins. Then I could care less and they can take all the time they want.
 

Mike

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Diamond Tim, you hit right on my point. Instead of trying to get more hours, we need to focus on more money for what we do.

Detention time should be paid when we are held up, providing we made the appointment time. And if it is a case of being dispatched on a load late, the company we drive for should still pay us detention time once we are held up at a shipper or receiver.

Start paying me $25.00 per hour after I am at the dock for an hour, at every shipper/receiver, and I don't care how long I end up sitting. And those hours will count against my 10 hours. I get paid for sitting, and then I am close to using up my hours, which puts the company in a bind for having me at a shipper for too long, and also puts the shipper and receiver in a bind because their freight might be late due to being held up. Regardless, I get paid.

Instead, what we seem to push for is more hours, so we can hustle, while fatigued, to get these loads delivered.

Gotta change our way of thinking out there if we are ever going to make this a lucrative job again.
 

pja1965

Life is a race
Thought

They are trying to put every body in to one catergory and it doesen't work. The way the rules are now fits local and reganal drivers that have multipal stops and took these jobs so they could be home more often. Is this fair to OTR drivers no.

How about this in a 24 hr period you have to take 10 continous hours off that leaves the other 14 and out of that 14 you can only work 11 hours and out of that 11 hours you can only work 4 hours at a time with out taking at least a 1 hour break.

Start working at 3:00 am work till 7:00 am take 1 hour break back to work at 8:00 am work till 12:00 pm take 2 hour break back to work at 2:00 pm work till 5:00 pm and take your 10 off.


Just a thought.:D
 

Snake Eyes

Active Member
Well, I am probably the unpopular one of the group here, but I have no problem with the 14 hour clock, and to be honest, I wouldn't mind them dropping it to 12 or less.

If I start my day at 6:00 in the morning, I have no intentions of still being "at work" at 6:00 in the evening. I wouldn't do that if I had any other type of job, and I very rarely do it as a driver.

I like that idea of 10 hours maximum per day. Screw working extra hours to make money, make them pay us more for what we do!
 

Moonpie

Well-Known Member
They need to regulate the shipping and receiving times. Make it a violation to keep a load waiting more then 2 hours. Make it a violation for shippers and receivers to try to force a driver to leave a site when their hours are depleted. Regulate the shippers and receivers and charge them with fines and a point system
 

mndriver

curmudgeon extraordinare
Supporter
You are asking them to regulate an industry they have no authority over. That's a big issue.

I'd see how you could nail them with an OSHA safety violation or something. But FMCSA isn't it.

It already IS a violation for a driver to move in violation of HOS regs. The problem is, it can only be attributed to the driver. Maybe the carrier if they tell him to move.
 

Moonpie

Well-Known Member
Sometimes they regulate things they appear not to have authority over. Doesn't the government have the authority to implement a system of regulations for interstate commerce?
 

Moonpie

Well-Known Member
Well some one needs to do it. Doesn't matter if it is FMCSA, DOC, DOBR, or any new group assigned to the task.
 

mndriver

curmudgeon extraordinare
Supporter
myself,
I'd return the 5/5 split.
10 hours driving in a 24 hour period.

Yes, I'd like to see something done about detention. As it is now, I simply bill people at $90/hr. Most times, I call and tell them detention is starting, I am outta there in less than 20 minutes. This is a more complicated topic.

As to driver pay, my payscale would revolve around a full salary. There would be ZERO per mile pay. It would simply not be allowed. Starting salary for a trainee would be $38,000 annually. It goes up with experience from there.
 

mndriver

curmudgeon extraordinare
Supporter
Well some one needs to do it. Doesn't matter if it is FMCSA, DOC, DOBR, or any new group assigned to the task.
"Someone" is the motorcarriers. It is OUR equipment and OUR employees that are being abused and such.

In March last spring, I got into a pissin' match with a person whom is no longer speaking to me. My case is that so long as we, the motor carriers, allow this behavior to happen, it will continue. His point was that it's always been this way and it always will be this way, and no amount of whining from a carrier will change it. I told him so long as fools like him felt that way, it would continue to be that way and sooner or later, motor carriers are going to either have to stand up for ourselves or fail.
 

Moonpie

Well-Known Member
"Someone" is the motorcarriers. It is OUR equipment and OUR employees that are being abused and such.

In March last spring, I got into a pissin' match with a person whom is no longer speaking to me. My case is that so long as we, the motor carriers, allow this behavior to happen, it will continue. His point was that it's always been this way and it always will be this way, and no amount of whining from a carrier will change it. I told him so long as fools like him felt that way, it would continue to be that way and sooner or later, motor carriers are going to either have to stand up for ourselves or fail.
I agree 100%. Just let me know when.
 

Injun

Rabid Squaw
Staff member
Supporter
"Someone" is the motorcarriers. It is OUR equipment and OUR employees that are being abused and such.

In March last spring, I got into a pissin' match with a person whom is no longer speaking to me. My case is that so long as we, the motor carriers, allow this behavior to happen, it will continue. His point was that it's always been this way and it always will be this way, and no amount of whining from a carrier will change it. I told him so long as fools like him felt that way, it would continue to be that way and sooner or later, motor carriers are going to either have to stand up for ourselves or fail.
The same applies to rates.

How's that workin' out for us?
 

Rigjockey

In Gord we trust!
Supporter
The perfect HOS is different for every application trucking, Pretty sure everyone understands that.

That being said, The question was MY perfect hours of service. I am quite content with the 11 and 14. however the need for a half hour break needs to go. Im not even sure how to regulate allowing a driver to stop for a break and not have the company use that to force the drivers to drive when they are delayed at a customer.

I just completed a western Canada run. It was great not to have to worry about the 1/2 hour break. The most I ran was 12.25 hours with a 15 minute break.
I could have run 13 hours in a 16 hour window with a 14 workday.
Honestly, That is a bit much. I got the case of the **** its a few time and was pretty much on U.S. HOS.

I never, EVER, Want to see the split sleeper birth come back ever again! A person needs solid sleep not broke up sleep.

Detention time is a separate issue. One place I worked for paid detention and charged detention after an hour. To me that is fair. there is no reason in the world why a trailer cannot be loaded or unloaded in under an hour. Barring any circumstance like a power outage.

Companies have some kind of nerve, When all the workers go to lunch at the same time. You ordered this crap, I got it there for my appointment and now you all are going to lunch? What do you all have to hold hands eating lunch singing praises to the almighty union leader?
 

Injun

Rabid Squaw
Staff member
Supporter
My perfect HOS would read: No more than 10 hours Driving or 12 hours total On Duty, to include Driving time, in any 24-hour period.

That's it.
 

Mike

Well-Known Member
Staff member
My perfect HOS would read: No more than 10 hours Driving or 12 hours total On Duty, to include Driving time, in any 24-hour period.

That's it.
Simple and to the point, and I could easily be happy with that.
 
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