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Old 05-27-2008   #1
    Removing Oil from Stock Market
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We need to all get together and get a petition for the removal of Oil from the stock market. This is 1 major issue that is causing the economy to fail. the big businessmen and Oil Execs have made so much money on oil predicting that our economy is failing and they don't seem to care. If oil was removed from the stock market the price would be reasonable for all.

Anyone else have an opinion on this?
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Old 05-27-2008   #2
    Oil Stocks Make Money...
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Apparently you have no oil stocks. If you did you might have a different prospective.

If you own some mutual fund shares, you may be "big oil" yourself and not even realize it.

It is not a zero sum game. Just because the oil brokers are doing well doesn't mean that money is removed from the economy and someone else lost it. It's still there and is circulating.

Also, keep in mind your proposal would put a lot of retirees in the poor house if they lost the portion of their investment income that was tied to "big oil". Wouldn't you hate to know you caused a little old Grandma to have to start eating pet food to exist.

Another thing to consider is that if the oil speculation market was shut down in America, those dollars would be immediately reinvested into a foreign oil speculation market. Same story, but different country, and now that money is removed from our economy. Not good.

I feel your pain. Fuel cost, alone, are killing my mobility, and my comfort level. However, a sweeping change, such as removing oil from the stock market, ain't the ticket. If you want to do something, apply some pressure to your politicians to stop bowing to the Marxist within the "green" movement and legislate us back into the oil producers and refiners we are. Let American ingenuity and capitalism loose and you'll see some changes, fast.
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Old 05-27-2008   #3
 
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Apparently you have no oil stocks. If you did you might have a different prospective.

If you own some mutual fund shares, you may be "big oil" yourself and not even realize it.

It is not a zero sum game. Just because the oil brokers are doing well doesn't mean that money is removed from the economy and someone else lost it. It's still there and is circulating.

Also, keep in mind your proposal would put a lot of retirees in the poor house if they lost the portion of their investment income that was tied to "big oil". Wouldn't you hate to know you caused a little old Grandma to have to start eating pet food to exist.

Another thing to consider is that if the oil speculation market was shut down in America, those dollars would be immediately reinvested into a foreign oil speculation market. Same story, but different country, and now that money is removed from our economy. Not good.

I feel your pain. Fuel cost, alone, are killing my mobility, and my comfort level. However, a sweeping change, such as removing oil from the stock market, ain't the ticket. If you want to do something, apply some pressure to your politicians to stop bowing to the Marxist within the "green" movement and legislate us back into the oil producers and refiners we are. Let American ingenuity and capitalism loose and you'll see some changes, fast.
As a matter of fact i have had to cash in my stocks just to survive. If things keep going like they are now all the old people will be eating dog food anyway. If the economy and people keep losing homes,jobs, etc who's left to strengthen the economy. The Politicians??? I don't think so.

So many people are going broke and people are still taking advantage. The oil companies say Oil is up due to demand, well many are staying home, losing cars, and not using as much fuel, but the price is still rising. Why is This???
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Old 05-27-2008   #4
 
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As a matter of fact i have had to cash in my stocks just to survive. If things keep going like they are now all the old people will be eating dog food anyway. If the economy and people keep losing homes,jobs, etc who's left to strengthen the economy. The Politicians??? I don't think so.

So many people are going broke and people are still taking advantage. The oil companies say Oil is up due to demand, well many are staying home, losing cars, and not using as much fuel, but the price is still rising. Why is This???
We are not the only country "demanding" oil to run our economy. There is extreme pressure on the market to supply India and China. They are suddenly huge consumers. Also, the actual demand, or shortage need not exist. If the demand is just perceived it drives the price up. That's why the futures market is playing the role it is.

Speaking of market forces, did you know we sell American oil pumped in Alaska, and buy Canadian oil for our use? It seems we can sell our oil to a foreign country for more than the Canadian oil cost to import. Go figure?? I'd hate to be an oil trader right now. Too much schmidt to figure out, and fastly.

Hang in there. The bubble is about to burst. Many of these oil traders are gonna' get soaked unless they bet low. When they begin betting low, fuel cost will improve.

The next environmental extremist you see, smack them. Maybe you'll awaken them.
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Old 05-27-2008   #5
 
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I touched on some of this on thread to petition for more oil drlling. I do know we are one of the ONLY countries that have not nationalized our oil industry, since most people of the world consider it a matter of national security. The main reason we haven't is it is communism in its purest form. Heaven forbid we take off our flag pin long enough to see who's got their hand in our wallet. I'm not a communist put if we don't stop Big Oil we're all going to be homeless. I think we can hit them in the nuts using the marketplace, we've got to play dirty like they do. First use food and military protection as a weapon to force down the price of oil that is being artificially inflated. One barrel of oil for one ear of corn to all OPEC countries.Oh I know the experts say that won't work, I say let's try anyway. Has the price gone down by listening to the global economists? Second, we push our renewable fuels onto the market that WE produce and control. Third, if any CEO ships our jobs overseas, we extradite them to their new homeland and take away their right to ever step foot in this country again! How's that for a start?
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Old 05-27-2008   #6
 
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We are not the only country "demanding" oil to run our economy. There is extreme pressure on the market to supply India and China. They are suddenly huge consumers. Also, the actual demand, or shortage need not exist. If the demand is just perceived it drives the price up. That's why the futures market is playing the role it is.

Speaking of market forces, did you know we sell American oil pumped in Alaska, and buy Canadian oil for our use? It seems we can sell our oil to a foreign country for more than the Canadian oil cost to import. Go figure?? I'd hate to be an oil trader right now. Too much schmidt to figure out, and fastly.

Hang in there. The bubble is about to burst. Many of these oil traders are gonna' get soaked unless they bet low. When they begin betting low, fuel cost will improve.

The next environmental extremist you see, smack them. Maybe you'll awaken them.
Where do you come up with those BUZZ WORDS? Environmental extremist? Give me a break!
I guess the Native American Indians were all environmental extremist too?
Just try and smack someone who wants to leave their children an uncontaminated planet to live on like God intended! If that makes me an environmental extremist I'll were it proudly "now come and get you some, bitch"!
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Old 05-27-2008   #7
  Exclamation  More fodder born every minute......
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We are not the only country "demanding" oil to run our economy. There is extreme pressure on the market to supply India and China. They are suddenly huge consumers. Also, the actual demand, or shortage need not exist. If the demand is just perceived it drives the price up. That's why the futures market is playing the role it is.

Speaking of market forces, did you know we sell American oil pumped in Alaska, and buy Canadian oil for our use? It seems we can sell our oil to a foreign country for more than the Canadian oil cost to import. Go figure?? I'd hate to be an oil trader right now. Too much schmidt to figure out, and fastly.

Hang in there. The bubble is about to burst. Many of these oil traders are gonna' get soaked unless they bet low. When they begin betting low, fuel cost will improve.

The next environmental extremist you see, smack them. Maybe you'll awaken them.
I keep telling my Congressmen this, but when did Congress lessen to America. The fact is that BP & EXXON are exporting as much as 40% of the oil been pumped out of Alaska. The percentage adjusts in order to keep crude price up in the U.S.

Oregon's REP. Peter Defazio would put a stop to this practice in his bill to bring crude prices down.

Everyone needs to check this website out. I'm a history buff, and this pretty much puts what is happening in perspective. This should make people blink in high gear. We the citizens of this nation are really not thought of as being all that importent, as Barnem said "There a sucker born every minute" in this case the quote should read there more fodder born every minute.

We Have Met the North American Union by Anthony Gregory
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Old 05-27-2008   #8
  Exclamation  Nationizes the Oil industry?! Why Not?
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I touched on some of this on thread to petition for more oil drlling. I do know we are one of the ONLY countries that have not nationalized our oil industry, since most people of the world consider it a matter of national security. The main reason we haven't is it is communism in its purest form. Heaven forbid we take off our flag pin long enough to see who's got their hand in our wallet. I'm not a communist put if we don't stop Big Oil we're all going to be homeless. I think we can hit them in the nuts using the marketplace, we've got to play dirty like they do. First use food and military protection as a weapon to force down the price of oil that is being artificially inflated. One barrel of oil for one ear of corn to all OPEC countries.Oh I know the experts say that won't work, I say let's try anyway. Has the price gone down by listening to the global economists? Second, we push our renewable fuels onto the market that WE produce and control. Third, if any CEO ships our jobs overseas, we extradite them to their new homeland and take away their right to ever step foot in this country again! How's that for a start?
I've been preaching the Nationalization of the oil industry for the last 7 years, but as soon as you say it, the cannon fodder starts screaming Pinko Commie! Just shows how well they've been trained to react to logical thinking.

The U.S. is the only nation that does not regulate the oil industry, but when it comes time to build pipelines it's our tax money that pays the bills. But our Corporate Congresses knows it has poor business management skills, so they will never touch that one. Hell I know people making minimum wage that would do a better job of managing the Oil Slicks.

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Old 05-27-2008   #9
 
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As a matter of fact i have had to cash in my stocks just to survive. If things keep going like they are now all the old people will be eating dog food anyway. If the economy and people keep losing homes,jobs, etc who's left to strengthen the economy. The Politicians??? I don't think so.

So many people are going broke and people are still taking advantage. The oil companies say Oil is up due to demand, well many are staying home, losing cars, and not using as much fuel, but the price is still rising. Why is This???

Propaganda, my friend. Look at the source that's making those statements. They're raping America...plain and simple.

I live in an area that gets a lot of traffic during the holiday periods. We didn't see anything near what's usual around these parts...as a matter of fact, it was down right sad (I saw less than 10 campers/RV's - usually we've got travelers every around here.) Yet the national media reported holiday travel was up 20%. It doesn't take a very smart man to figure out we're being lied to. By our government, big oil AND our media.

-ss-
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Old 05-28-2008   #10
 
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The stock Market is not the problem. The electronic trading in oil futures is the culprit. It is less regulated and requires only a ten percent cash in, half of what the stock market requires.
So a million invested in futures acquires ten million in oil futures.
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Another thing to consider is that if the oil speculation market was shut down in America, those dollars would be immediately reinvested into a foreign oil speculation market. Same story, but different country, and now that money is removed from our economy. Not good.
There is no way to know if that is true, electronic trading hides where the money comes from. Most is said to come from retirement funds but could be used by foreigners or anyone even to launder money. Without oversight there is no control. It is likely that very little of this money will ever see circulation in America or the market. All monies made from this type of investment removes money from our economy at ten times the rate invested. We do not know into who's hands it ends up or where the majority of it comes from.
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It is not a zero sum game. Just because the oil brokers are doing well doesn't mean that money is removed from the economy and someone else lost it. It's still there and is circulating.
While the money is not lost, it does change hands. From the consumer to the investors in the form of profit. This money may trade again elsewhere but it will not see circulation from the pockets it came from. We pay it at the pump and corporations and individuals keep it as profit.

Last edited by shadowdr; 05-28-2008 at 07:40 AM.
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Old 06-01-2008   #11
    Extreme Environmental Confusion
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Where do you come up with those BUZZ WORDS? Environmental extremist? Give me a break!
I guess the Native American Indians were all environmental extremist too?
Just try and smack someone who wants to leave their children an uncontaminated planet to live on like God intended! If that makes me an environmental extremist I'll were it proudly "now come and get you some, bitch"!
I will type slowly. Please, try to pay attention, and, comprehend the meaning of the words.

An extremist is anyone who goes completely beyond what is considered to be reasonable and prudent behavior. An "environmental extremist" is one who might advocate laws that would ban such things as the internal combustion engine, any usage of petrochemicals, outlawing wooden furniture and other construction that required the harvesting of trees, forbidding the consumption of meats due to the hazards involved with animal farts and farming to raise the stock, and declaring we are doomed due to some predicted global warming when the facts indicate the earth is actually cooling. Ha! A decade ago, the same idiots were exclaiming the coming of an ice age that would freeze us all.

There are Marxist (that's a commie, just to be sure you understand) who have intentions of bringing America to her knees via disabling our abilities to prosper with our capitalistic economy. Marxist think capitalism is bad. Very bad. They try to figure out ways to make it fail. Marxist have found a home in the environmentalist movement. Hell, they probably created it. If America can't have industry, energy, and transportation because there is a degree of pollution involved, we fall on our economic faces. The Marxist know this, and are attempting to make it impossible for us to exist in the manner which has served us well by raising "environmental" objections to the industries that fuel capitalism. If anyone dares to disagree with their assertions they are quickly labeled polluters who want to poison the planet's air and water, even if scientific evidence says otherwise.

We can't drill for oil, we can't build new refineries, we can't split atoms (for peaceful purposes), and we are about to be slammed with a "carbon tax" that will "save the polar bears", and fund further Marxist indoctrinations.

I'm not sure what environmental positions the Native American Indians held. That was way before my time. It is pretty obvious they weren't too smart though. They were defeated rather quickly. Had they killed the new comers as soon as they set foot on the shore, and continued to do so, they would have prevailed and kept their lands. But, they lost and to the victors go the spoils.

I don't pretend to know what your God intended. I do know that we should all do our part to insure we have clean air to breathe, and pure water to drink. Yes, we should be good stewards of the environment and keep our messes cleaned up. However, we should also realize that mankind is a part of nature. When we pump some oil, light a fire, or harvest resources it is "natural". Unless we do something really stupid, and, in a big fashion, nature usually compensates and helps with the remediation. Oh! Speaking of nature. Good ol' Mother Earth can burp a fair amount of pollution in the form of fire, brimstone, smoke, and ash when she wants too. She can come along and wipe out thousands, and thousands of lives in one good shake, or, strong wind, as well. In the grand scheme of things, man is almost irrelevant, and just along for the ride.

As far as smacking you is concerned, I fear it would be a wasted effort. Some folks could be beat over the head with a book of knowledge to no avail. There are some things that just can't be fixed.

And, as much as I appreciate your offer to "now come and get you some, bitch"!, I must decline. I'm almost certain you are the wrong gender, and even if you aren't the wrong gender, you are positively not my type.

Now, hurry along. Algore and the polar bears are waiting for you down at the theater. Bring your friends and family. They need for you to buy some tickets otherwise the coorporate jet will run out of fuel.
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Old 06-02-2008   #12
 
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first off the futures market requires only 5% and the rest of the market aroung 50% secondly futres are non regulated and require non shipment of product
so what this means is you and i can sit here all day on a computer put up 5% and fix oil prices all day long and never have to receive shipment of the oil
as for the mutual funds
yes 401 k's and retirements are in this but if this gets stopped guess what the retired people will live better cause they will find other investments to invest in which means that stock will skyrocket due to volumn buying and if the price of oil comes down to where it should be they will be able to heat the home again with out going in the poor house
so lets say you make 20% on a 500000 dollar investment guess what figure it out it doesn't cover the 3 to 4 times increase of cost of living
google was a good stock for mutual funds awhile back do you remember it was damn close to if it didn't hit it $700 a share
pull the mutual funds it dropped to mid $400 a share
there are plenty of other investments 401k's can make money in and still be able to live comfortably with out bread eggs milk gas heating oil to be through the roof
think about it!!!!
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Old 06-02-2008   #13
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We need to all get together and get a petition for the removal of Oil from the stock market. This is 1 major issue that is causing the economy to fail. the big businessmen and Oil Execs have made so much money on oil predicting that our economy is failing and they don't seem to care. If oil was removed from the stock market the price would be reasonable for all.

Anyone else have an opinion on this?

Not going to happen .... but it wouldn't be a bad idea to take oil off the Commodities market .... we're being Enroned at the pump, same crap, no regulation by Gov. We hear these dumbasses talking about less government, don't regulate business .... and in return we got Enron, Now we have no regulation at all in the Commodities markets. That means no rules, no one looking over the bastards shoulder while the stick it to us. The Gov needs to put leash on these scum-bags, and every time they take a step out of line we jerk the bastards up off the ground an boot them in the ass like a football.
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Old 06-02-2008   #14
 
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Not going to happen .... but it wouldn't be a bad idea to take oil off the Commodities market .... we're being Enroned at the pump, same crap, no regulation by Gov. We hear these dumbasses talking about less government, don't regulate business .... and in return we got Enron, Now we have no regulation at all in the Commodities markets. That means no rules, no one looking over the bastards shoulder while the stick it to us. The Gov needs to put leash on these scum-bags, and every time they take a step out of line we jerk the bastards up off the ground an boot them in the ass like a football.


DAMN RIGHT WELL SAID
Couldn't agree more!!!
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Old 06-02-2008   #15
 
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As far as smacking you is concerned, I fear it would be a wasted effort. Some folks could be beat over the head with a book of knowledge to no avail. There are some things that just can't be fixed.
You will have your day! As far as the Native Americans not being too smart,I hate to be the bearer of bad news but time will tell who was most intelligent...

[IMG]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/HP_ADM%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpg[/IMG]





Only a complete fool destroys his environment!


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Old 06-02-2008   #16
 
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Not going to happen .... but it wouldn't be a bad idea to take oil off the Commodities market .... we're being Enroned at the pump, same crap, no regulation by Gov. We hear these dumbasses talking about less government, don't regulate business .... and in return we got Enron, Now we have no regulation at all in the Commodities markets. That means no rules, no one looking over the bastards shoulder while the stick it to us. The Gov needs to put leash on these scum-bags, and every time they take a step out of line we jerk the bastards up off the ground an boot them in the ass like a football.
The dumb asses are the ones wanting bigger government when they cant control the one they have!
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Old 06-02-2008   #17
  Cool  I should have typed slower...
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The dumb asses are the ones wanting bigger government when they cant control the one they have!
Great point. It really is. I ain't just saying that.

That's why I can't get a grip on your reasoning concerning the environmental zealots who have forced America into a situation where we can't harvest our own natural resources and produce enough of the products needed to fuel our economy, thus causing us to be at the mercy of some third world dictator's whims regarding oil supplies, which contributes to out of control pricing and dependence.

Who do you think writes the environmental regulations and enforces this doctrine? The EPA, a government bureaucracy (bigger government) that bows to the whims of every special environmental interest group that petitions, or sues them in a liberal federal court.
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Old 06-02-2008   #18
 
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We have enough oil in the US to sustain us.. we dont have the refineries. We dont have the development of technology to extract the oil from all the oil shale we have. We have so much NG held behind pipe because it is not profitable to move it cause the gas companies control what you can sell to them after you pay a huge amount( 250.000) to tap into their pipeline..
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Old 06-03-2008   #19
 
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We have enough oil in the US to sustain us.. we dont have the refineries. We dont have the development of technology to extract the oil from all the oil shale we have. We have so much NG held behind pipe because it is not profitable to move it cause the gas companies control what you can sell to them after you pay a huge amount( 250.000) to tap into their pipeline..


excuse me but check this company out that is drilling sideways into shale etc i own stock in these guys check out what they do in this country
they take old so called druied up wells of oil and gas and drill differently and get millions of barrels out of these wells that were suposedly dried up
go figure i haven't made any money with these guys yet but the more we push for oil from here and stop exporting it these guys will get it on



Striker Oil & Gas Announces It Expects Fiscal 2008 Revenue to Increase by 66% to $5,000,000 and Provides Cayuga Update
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Old 06-03-2008   #20
 
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excuse me but check this company out that is drilling sideways into shale etc i own stock in these guys check out what they do in this country
they take old so called druied up wells of oil and gas and drill differently and get millions of barrels out of these wells that were suposedly dried up
go figure i haven't made any money with these guys yet but the more we push for oil from here and stop exporting it these guys will get it on



Striker Oil & Gas Announces It Expects Fiscal 2008 Revenue to Increase by 66% to $5,000,000 and Provides Cayuga Update
(sois) walstreet symbol
People I am sorry, I have read this post over and over again, kept turning away.
I do not intend on starting a fight and I will
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You are fighting for your own gain, ju