OFFICIAL, NATIONAL "SAY NO TO CHEAP FREIGHT" DAY !!! MAY 1, 2008

[TheLittleGuy]

As a continuation to the National Trucker Strike on April 1, 2008, we ( the Owner-Operator and Independent trucking community) believe that our message about rising costs and non-compensatory freight must be realized beyond government and consumer awareness. It needs to be heard in the brokerage houses and by EVERY freight shipper across the country!
According to Foxnews.com, on April 1st, 2008, Owner-Operators and Independent Truckers represented approximately 90% of the trucks on the road everyday, nationally. That equates to approximately 500,000 trucks.
We believe that, in many cases, the freight rates including fuel surcharges are inadequate to the service that we provide. There are brokerage houses out there that are notorious for undercutting rates and/or failing to pass along 100% of the fuel surcharge to the person whom is paying for the fuel. Many of these brokerage houses have flourished and have some of the best credit ratings in the business. Meanwhile, carriers that haul their freight have gone bankrupt.
In some industries, shippers refuse to even pay a fuel surcharge, expecting carriers to absorb the cost.
Being such, we wish to make it known that we provide an essential service, hauling other peoples' freight. In doing so, we will NOT absorb a cost that is essential to providing that service. Fuel surcharges must be compensatory to current fuel prices and equipment efficiency and MUST be paid 100% to the person that buys said fuel. We believe that freight rates and fuel surcharges MUST incorporate TOTAL mileage, not just loaded mileage. Shippers and receivers must be held accountable for detention and layover times. Poor or improper planning on your part does not constitute an expense on our part!
WE ARE OPERATING A BUSINESS TOO!
And so, we invite ALL owner-operators, independent drivers, expediters, and the such to participate on May 1st, 2008 by SAYING NO TO CHEAP FREIGHT! Whether you are local, regional, or over-the-road.

[TheLittleGuy]

Mods, Sticky please???

[beeble736]

MAKE SOME NOISE!!! Get on your CB and talk this up guys! Super idea, I think I'm gonna make some more fliers!!! I'm on a roll here with fliers!!

Bea

[TheLittleGuy]

personally, I began boycotting C.H. Robinson on April 1st. Their cheap rates have broken the backs of many a-good companies. Imagine if everyone said "no" to them for just one day and on that one day they could move NO freight! they are a publicly traded company, so they are held responsible by their stakeholders. However, they are also held responsible by the companies that rely upon them to get their freight shipped.

[Bullwinkle]

This is a very smart thing to do on May 1st, but in reality, this is something that everyone needs to be doing on a daily basis. Hopefully this day will wake a bunch of people up to the importance of fair freight rates.

[gearjammer]

Im have been saying no to cheap freight all week of course I have been sitting all week, i did get a temp control load that picks up tonight but it is only a 250 mile run.
I turn down loads and then see that they get them covered,it really does make me wonder if people know how to figure their expenses I have my business running lean and mean and still some of theses rates were paying in negative numbers with nothing that would offset the fact that I would have ended up paying to do the loads, is it stupidity or desperation that causes people to pay to run theses loads??
only thing i look forward too is the industry run out of the stupid ones and the desperate ones start banding together and say NO,frankly if they don't then they just slipped into the stupid category,either way eventually there will not be enough trucks left and the ones that are will be able to raise their rates.

[bigtime]

The only problem is, whats cheap? Cheap to me, may not be too you. Some of us have paid off trucks, some of us may have hauled in a load for a really good rate and can afford to take something "cheaper", etc.

As for C.H., they have cheap stuff but believe it or not, I have hauled some of their loads through my company at a very nice rate. A nice rate after it passed through their hands, and thorugh my company's agent, and then to me.

The point is, its all relative isn't it?

I agree with gearjammer. I see a lot of loads that I think, "there is noooo way thats going to move!" And the next thing I know, its gone. Whose the fool who took it? Always wondered that. Hmmm...

[gearjammer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigtime The only problem is, whats cheap? Cheap to me, may not be too you. Some of us have paid off trucks, some of us may have hauled in a load for a really good rate and can afford to take something "cheaper", etc. As for C.H., they have cheap stuff but believe it or not, I have hauled some of their loads through my company at a very nice rate. A nice rate after it passed through their hands, and thorugh my company's agent, and then to me. The point is, its all relative isn't it? I agree with gearjammer. I see a lot of loads that I think, "there is noooo way thats going to move!" And the next thing I know, its gone. Whose the fool who took it? Always wondered that. Hmmm...

that argument really doesn't wash, if your truck is paid off [mine is] you still have to save for another one and/or the increased maintenance of an older truck, as for taking a cheaper load after a good load, really why does people think they need to run cheap just because the last load paid a fair rate, what is wrong with ALL loads paying a fair rate, if people would quit hauling all cheap freight then rates would rise, of course I understand that this won't happen because an awful lot of people cannot see that they are driving rates down and running themselves out of business all at the same time, if you are in the position that you have to haul a cheap load to survive I got news for you ,you have already died business wise

[bigtime]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gearjammer that argument really doesn't wash, if your truck is paid off [mine is] you still have to save for another one and/or the increased maintenance of an older truck, as for taking a cheaper load after a good load, really why does people think they need to run cheap just because the last load paid a fair rate, what is wrong with ALL loads paying a fair rate, if people would quit hauling all cheap freight then rates would rise, of course I understand that this won't happen because an awful lot of people cannot see that they are driving rates down and running themselves out of business all at the same time, if you are in the position that you have to haul a cheap load to survive I got news for you ,you have already died business wise

Thats great, if you live in a vacuum. The system we have now was set up to benefit the consumer and manufacturers, NOT truckers. No two loads are alike, no two drivers are alike, no two companies are alike.

The problem is as an O/O you need to make money off ONE truck. JB Hunt has 1000's of trucks it can make money off of. If all of JB's trucks only make a dollar a day after paying the bills- he's doing good.

Ever shop online? Notice almost everybody has a different price for the same item? Thats capitalism. Some have higher overhead than others, some just bought more and thus got a lower price so they can sell cheaper, etc.

Also, you still haven't defined what is a "fair rate." I don't haul a lot of cheap loads, but I am not going to lie and say I never do or never will. Example, I went down to FL for an UNBELIEVABLE rate. Now should I sit down in FL, idling my butt off losing money OR grab a cheap load? I took a "cheap" load, still covered all my expenses and made a little money. Just not as much as the load I brought down. I didn't have to sit, I didn't have to idle, I didn't lose anything. I delivered the next day and got back on track since that "cheap" load got me into a better freight area.

[Bullwinkle]

And as long as there are people out there willing to take those "cheap" loads just to get a backhaul and get out of town, the rates on those loads will remain cheap. So now, by being willing to haul that cheap load, the great rate that you came into Florida on ends up being "not so great" and this shipper gets to continue taking advantage of the trucking industry. This is something that needs to be stopped.

To come up with a fair rate, everyone needs to "assume" the cost of a truck payment when calculating what they feel is a fair rate. You never know when the time will come that you need to make a truck payment. So basically, the time you spend running with a paid off truck should simply equal higher profit for your business.

• A "fair rate" should be a rate that allows for the cost of covering a truck payment ( personally, I would figure in the cost of a new truck, non-financed, and divide it into a monthly escrow that I put into for approximately 4-5 years). At that point, you are assured that when your truck starts getting to the point where warranty is going away and breakdowns are beginning to increase, you can go to the dealer and cut a check for a new truck.
• A "fair rate" should be covering the above expense, and covering all of the typical fixed costs of operating a truck and/or trailer.
• A "fair rate" should pay me a good monthly salary, without the need to run illegally out on the road. For me, a good salary is $1200-$1500 per week or $5000-$6000 per month.
• A "fair rate" should factor in the costs of things like health insurance that I must now provide for my family because I don't work for a company that is kicking in part of the premiums.
• A "fair rate" should factor in "profit" for my company, which is in addition to the salary I am paying myself.

Why would anybody want to run up and down the road all the time, being away from their family for days/weeks at at time, only to reach the age of 65, or in may drivers cases, 75-80, only to realize that you must now spend your retirement age on social security and unable to go and do whatever you want.

If I am going to spend all this time away from home, I want to make better money that what I could with a typical local job of any kind. I need to be paid better for doing a job where it is a know fact that it puts an increased strain on family life. If I am going to be out here, the last thing I am going to be worrying about is paying bills and what I am going to do when I retire.

So, when you take that cheap backhaul, just to get out of town, and basically contribute to helping freight remain cheap in that area that you just came out of, remember how you just assisted in taking a little bit away from every owner operator out there. All because you think it is OK to do so because you had a "great rate" going into that area.

[bigtime]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bullwinkle And as long as there are people out there willing to take those "cheap" loads just to get a backhaul and get out of town, the rates on those loads will remain cheap. So now, by being willing to haul that cheap load, the great rate that you came into Florida on ends up being "not so great" and this shipper gets to continue taking advantage of the trucking industry. This is something that needs to be stopped. To come up with a fair rate, everyone needs to "assume" the cost of a truck payment when calculating what they feel is a fair rate. You never know when the time will come that you need to make a truck payment. So basically, the time you spend running with a paid off truck should simply equal higher profit for your business. A "fair rate" should be a rate that allows for the cost of covering a truck payment ( personally, I would figure in the cost of a new truck, non-financed, and divide it into a monthly escrow that I put into for approximately 4-5 years). At that point, you are assured that when your truck starts getting to the point where warranty is going away and breakdowns are beginning to increase, you can go to the dealer and cut a check for a new truck. A "fair rate" should be covering the above expense, and covering all of the typical fixed costs of operating a truck and/or trailer. A "fair rate" should pay me a good monthly salary, without the need to run illegally out on the road. For me, a good salary is $1200-$1500 per week or $5000-$6000 per month. A "fair rate" should factor in the costs of things like health insurance that I must now provide for my family because I don't work for a company that is kicking in part of the premiums. A "fair rate" should factor in "profit" for my company, which is in addition to the salary I am paying myself. Why would anybody want to run up and down the road all the time, being away from their family for days/weeks at at time, only to reach the age of 65, or in may drivers cases, 75-80, only to realize that you must now spend your retirement age on social security and unable to go and do whatever you want. If I am going to spend all this time away from home, I want to make better money that what I could with a typical local job of any kind. I need to be paid better for doing a job where it is a know fact that it puts an increased strain on family life. If I am going to be out here, the last thing I am going to be worrying about is paying bills and what I am going to do when I retire. So, when you take that cheap backhaul, just to get out of town, and basically contribute to helping freight remain cheap in that area that you just came out of, remember how you just assisted in taking a little bit away from every owner operator out there. All because you think it is OK to do so because you had a "great rate" going into that area.

Wow. Congrats, you win the "longest answer award". Again, neither of you have said what a "fair rate" is. Your answer is YOUR ANSWER! How I run and how you run are obviously two different things. The fact is their are freight lanes. They pay differently each way, different parts of the country pay more than others, etc. Not to mention a load of potato chips pays differently than a convention load, etc.

AGAIN, we all have different costs, different needs, etc. Your health insurance might be $600 a month, mine is $211.

Bottom line it for me, do you want a federally mandated minimum? Should we federalize trucking and make everyone a government employee??? Should we go union again?

Honestly I would like that, government employees get paid WAY too much.

[Bullwinkle]

Different people have different rate needs due to what kind of freight they are running and how they are running. Someone running short haul freight needs to look for additional revenue. Someone hauling oversize will have different needs in terms of revenue.

Now if you want to split hairs and argue different health insurance rates for the simple fact of arguing (I know, truckers aren't happy unless they are arguing about something ), then things will fluctuate. The rates I would be looking at are rates for a family, and great coverage, and assuming the owner/operator is paying 100% of the coverage. Yes, they will fluctuate among different companies, but not very much.

When I last looked at the numbers, going with the assumption of running reefer/dry van, all 48 states, a good number that came up was $2.00/Mile + Full Fuel Surcharge.

Is the freight going to need to be lumped off? Pad the rate. Toll roads in the route? Pad the rate.

[bigtime]

The reason I pointed out health insurance rates was not to argue, it was to prove my point that we all have different costs, etc. which affects what we consider a fair rate. $2.00 a mile is fantastic, with fuel thats like $2.49 a mile. Not bad. Now that we agree every truck should get $2.00 a mile, how do we achieve that?

Just saying, "don't haul cheap freight" isn't going to do a thing. While you and I sit around the truckstop waiting for a $2.00 a mile load out of Mass., we can watch everyone else fueling up and leaving the state! If I head up to Mass for $2.80 a mile, and get a load out for $1.75; are you going to be mad cuz I am hauling "cheap freight" under your $2 a mile number plus fuel??? (2 weeks ago I did that exact thing, plus fuel) Averaged $2.27.

See where I am coming from? You can haul in for more, out for less and have it average a decent rate.

Go ahead and wait for $2.00 for all miles, but we all know some areas just don't pay that much coming out. But they pay more going in. The average is whats important. For me I'll take a lower rate over the weekend for miles and so I don't have to lay over, then do some higher paying short hauls Mon. through Thurs. Averaged out, it works.

Again, are you suggesting a government mandated rate? I guarantee getting every driver out here to not move for less is going to be impossible!

[Bullwinkle]

Will everyone stand up to not taking cheap freight? no. Just like not all drivers will support a shutdown. But the whole point of communicating with each other at places like this is to start working toward things like this.

For years now, this industry has not stood up to things "because the other guy wont do it". Just like when shutdown discussions start, I will hear drivers on the CB and XM radio saying "if I wake up and nobody is driving, then I will shut down". Well, that will never work because everyone is waiting for someone else to do it first.

If some want to continue hauling cheap freight, let them. For the rest of us who want to improve the industry, stand up against it and let it sit on the docks until someone does come in and haul it just to pay for their fuel out of town.

Or...

Just keep doing it the way everyone does it, and bitch about the low rates on the CB, and whine about how the lumper fees cut into all of your profit.

[Bullwinkle]

Remember, this is the O/O forum. In other forums, I plan on pushing to educate company drivers and potential company drivers to start demanding better money as well. This entire industry has been underpaid for too long.

[bigtime]

I don't whine about anything on the CB, and I won't haul anything that needs a lumper. Thats a discussion for another day. Let me get this straight, its your freight and I have to PAY to unload it? No. Why this industry puts up with that is beyond me! Next time UPS comes to your house try asking him for 5 bucks to unload your package. Tell him he's not allowed on your driveway without steel toed shoes, or a forklift license, or some other B.S. Then after he leaves you better be home tomorrow when, if your lucky, he tries to deliver it again! : )

[TheLittleGuy]

obviously, we should be saying no to cheap freight everyday. May 1st, however, is an opportunity for ALL non-company drivers to band together, stick together, and put our foot down in a united voice. We do that, knowing that the big companies CAN'T cover the freight, brokers and shippers will have to raise the rates or their freight sits.
CHEAP FREIGHT is CHEAP FREIGHT; regardless of what the fuel prices are. Profit margins have absorbed so much of the inflation and increases in taxes and insurance to the point where sky-rocketing fuel prices have turned "almost good" rates into "less than cheap" rates.
Simple, no-touch, dry van freight SHOULD be at least $1.00 per mile, plus an fsc of around $.80 per mile(based on current fuel prices and increasing emissions requirements). Look, I think we SHOULD turn SOME kind of profit off of the fsc! Increasing emissions means that we must upgrade our equipment for one. For two, these new ULSD engines honestly use more diesel than their LSD predecessors. So, a small profit off of fsc helps offset equipment upgrades and the loss of MPG. It takes green to become green!
Besides, April 1st was directed @ the oil companies and our fantabulous government and their ineptness. So, why shouldn't we set aside a specific day and direct all attention towards those whom pretend to assist us, but really are no better than the oil companies with their greed?
See, I could care less what the fuel prices are........so long as the rate and the fsc more than covers expenses and makes my business profitable. There's plenty of pie for everyone. But, some are more greedy and want to hog all the pie for themselves. They need to learn that, if you don't leave some for the cook, the pie won't get baked and then nobody has ANY pie!

[TheLittleGuy]

BTW, the $1.00 per mile for no-touch dry van is just a starting point. Specialty freight obviously must be more. And, the heavier the freight, the higher the fsc needs to be!! It takes more diesel to climb a mountain with 44,000 in the box than it does with 10,000 in the box!

[kandlautotransport]

just say NO - I agree, say NO to these greedy brokers who want autos moved cross country for pennies on the dollar - it's ridiculous - any of you auto haulers that use Central Dispatch, know what we mean - SAY NO TO CHEAP BROKERS, CHEAP FREIGHT!!!