Ron Paul for PRESIDENT

[rebel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bullwinkle Wow, Ron Paul For President really gets the blood flowing in here

You are quite right. Hopefully blood will flow to the brain

[2xR]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel I happen to be a calm person. I consider the violator of my God-given constitutonal rights a far greater threat than some camel jockey halfway across the world. Especially when that threat sits in the Whitehouse. If they attack us here - lets go to war. 3/4 of 9-11 hijackers were Saudi Arabian. Bin Laden - Saudi Arabian. So then we should invade.....Iraq? War for Oil? The truth hurts

Which of your many rights has the POTUS violated?

The camel jockeys came here. 3000+ died.

We went to war where they were hiding. Afghanistan. The fight is ongoing. It is spread over the entire region. Iraq was a maybe, but, not such a bad target, given Saddam's history. Strategically speaking, Iraq is a great place to have American forces gathered. Hell, we whupped Japan and Germany back in the 40s and we are still there, in a big way. Iran may be next. Also, a good place to kick some Muslim extremist terrorist arses.

We didn't invade Saudi Arabia because the kingdom is our ally, and exactly because of OIL. Had oil been the American goal the Saudis would have been smoked. I haven't heard even the most slanted liberally bias news account of how our invasion of Iraq has filled our tanks with oil. That is the country of Iraq's oil to sell to the highest bidder. Our tankers are not sitting at their docks unless we pay for the oil we take. Now, if stability in the region causes the oil to flow uninterrupted and without threats of disruptions you may have a point when you say we are there for oil.

The truth will set you free.

[freightmaster]

Quote:

Originally Posted by two-timer (2xR) Which of your many rights has the POTUS violated? The camel jockeys came here. 3000+ died. We went to war where they were hiding. Afghanistan. The fight is ongoing. It is spread over the entire region. Iraq was a maybe, but, not such a bad target, given Saddam's history. Strategically speaking, Iraq is a great place to have American forces gathered. Hell, we whupped Japan and Germany back in the 40s and we are still there, in a big way. Iran may be next. Also, a good place to kick some Muslim extremist terrorist arses. We didn't invade Saudi Arabia because the kingdom is our ally, and exactly because of OIL. Had oil been the American goal the Saudis would have been smoked. I haven't heard even the most slanted liberally bias news account of how our invasion of Iraq has filled our tanks with oil. That is the country of Iraq's oil to sell to the highest bidder. Our tankers are not sitting at their docks unless we pay for the oil we take. Now, if stability in the region causes the oil to flow uninterrupted and without threats of disruptions you may have a point when you say we are there for oil. The truth will set you free.

9/11was an inside job....i.e. false flag operation...Have you heard of the (Gulf of Tonkin)?
Gulf of Tonkin Incident

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Gulf of Tonkin Incident Part of Vietnam War
Chart showing the U.S. Navy's interpretation of the events of the first part of the Gulf of Tonkin incident Date August 2, 1964 Location Gulf of Tonkin, Vietnam Result United States victory Belligerents United States North Vietnam Commanders Admiral George Stephen Morrison N/A Strength 2 Destroyers
several aircraft 3 torpedo boats Casualties and losses 1 destroyer lightly damaged 1 torpedo boat sunk
1 torpedo boat damaged The Gulf of Tonkin Incident prompted the first large-scale involvement of U.S. armed forces in Vietnam. It was a pair of attacks perpetrated by naval forces of the Democratic Republic of Vietnam (the Communist government of North Vietnam) against two American destroyers, the USS Maddox and the USS Turner Joy. The incident occurred on August 2 and 4, 1964 in the Gulf of Tonkin.[1]
The outcome of the incident was the passage by Congress of the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution, which granted President Lyndon B. Johnson the authority to assist any Southeast Asian country whose government was considered to be jeopardized by "communist aggression". The resolution served as Johnson's legal justification for escalating American involvement in the Vietnam War, which lasted until 1975.
In 2005, it was revealed in an official NSA declassified report[2] that the USS Maddox first fired warning shots on the August 2 incident and that there may not have been North Vietnamese boats at the August 4 incident. The report said

[i]t is not simply that there is a different story as to what happened; it is that no attack happened that night. [...] In truth, Hanoi's navy was engaged in nothing that night but the salvage of two of the boats damaged on 2 August.[3]

Most intelligent Americans are finally figuring that fact out!

[freightmaster]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronin In my oath and obligation, I swore not to argue over notions about Freemasonry with those who are not Freemasons. If you want to pick a fight and completely insult my organization, I don't think its proper here, especially given that you only know what someone wrote in a book or the internet...and you don't know me. Like my dear old dad used to say...believe NONE of what you hear and only HALF of what you see. More profound words have never been spoken.

I am not insulting anyone, just stating facts.

Your fathers words hit the nail on the head....especially information coming from our media!

[rebel]

S L O W E R,
POTUS is violating OUR 4th amendment rights by listening to our phone conversations without a warrant. Bill just passed in Congress protecting phone companies who aided and abetted this crime.
As far as your ignorance in thinking Saudi Arabia is our ally and that Iraqis were in on
9-11, you can believe whatever King George tells you.
If you don't your enemy or his history you"d be better off staying put. We've already lost 4000+ lives added to 3000 on 9-11 and we have yet to get Bin Laden (a Saudi).
Nice going King George - Mission accomplished?

[rebel]

Freightmaster, I doubt that boy has any idea about Gulf of Tonkin or Vietnam. Iwas too young to be drafted but I remember the body counts every night on Huntley and Brinkley. That's why these young Republicans are so gung ho for war. They have no idea.....it's a damn shame.

[lunachic]

ditto to above, I remember the draft, and had friend's that did'nt come home.
It was student's that led the protest.

[ronin]

The funny thing is that the guys who bash the government and "organizations" usually don't qualify to be a member of any organizations or to serve the government....kinda funny. Saw that a lot with the lawfirm I worked for - they'd talk all their stuff, but would have never considered taking up arms to actually work and defend their country. Want to talk smack about the government, conspiracies, or private organizations? I think you need to be willing to get involved or volunteer for service before your opinion should be counted, versus just slinging silly crap from your easy chair....

[ronin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by freightmaster I am not insulting anyone, just stating facts. Your fathers words hit the nail on the head....especially information coming from our media!

That "fact" word sure gets thrown around freely....a "fact" might be what one person believes, but has no evidence of factual basis. Big difference in "fact" and "opinion". I know, I gave opinions for a living, got paid for it...and had to back up my opinions with a LOT of facts.

Just because you read it doesn't make it true...same with listening to non-qualified opinions. I always have to quantify the credibility of someone before I take their words as the Gospel.

[lunachic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronin The funny thing is that the guys who bash the government and "organizations" usually don't qualify to be a member of any organizations or to serve the government....kinda funny. Saw that a lot with the lawfirm I worked for - they'd talk all their stuff, but would have never considered taking up arms to actually work and defend their country. Want to talk smack about the government, conspiracies, or private organizations? I think you need to be willing to get involved or volunteer for service before your opinion should be counted, versus just slinging silly crap from your easy chair....

Law firm?
Not to high ranking in my book, driver.
heard a lawyer talk his shit, but could'nt walk the walk.
money game...uhm sounds kind of like oil and gov.
takes money to get justice, and money can defeat it..............

[ronin]

Not a lawyer, I did expert witness work for automotive legal cases, accident reconstruction, etc. Don't like lawyers, not in the least...BUT they paid well enough, AFTER they cancelled my health insurance while my oldest son was going through cancer treatment in order for me to pay over $150k in medical bills without taking a loan....so I used them a lot more than they used me, for sure.

[ronin]

lunachic - feel free to check out my website (www.automotiveexpertwitness.com) to see what I did for several years...I need to update the site with current case numbers (actually over 8,000), but then again, I'm not really in that line of work anymore.....more just writing books and driving trucks.

[lunachic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronin Not a lawyer, I did expert witness work for automotive legal cases, accident reconstruction, etc. Don't like lawyers, not in the least...BUT they paid well enough, AFTER they cancelled my health insurance while my oldest son was going through cancer treatment in order for me to pay over $150k in medical bills without taking a loan....so I used them a lot more than they used me, for sure.

sorry to hear about ur son, hope all goes well for him.
yea, I have real bad feeling's for lawyers.

[2xR]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel POTUS is violating OUR 4th amendment rights by listening to our phone conversations without a warrant. Bill just passed in Congress protecting phone companies who aided and abetted this crime.

If your fourth amendment right has been violated by a wiretap I challenge you to prove it. If you are a terrorist, never-mind, I understand your reluctance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel Freightmaster, I doubt that boy has any idea about Gulf of Tonkin or Vietnam. I was too young to be drafted but I remember the body counts every night on Huntley and Brinkley. That's why these young Republicans are so gung ho for war. They have no idea.....it's a damn shame.

Now that was a blatant assumption about something of which you have no clue. In my humblest opinion, you have lost the meager credibility to which you were so desperately clinging because you have spouted your assumption as an absolute truth. Although deeply insulted, all I'll say on this subject is that I lost the lottery, I lost some friends, and I lost some family. Congress lost that war like they tried to loose in Iraq. Dayum Dimocrats and their foolish supporters.

[lunachic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by two-timer (2xR) If your fourth amendment right has been violated by a wiretap I challenge you to prove it. If you are a terrorist, never-mind, I understand your reluctance. Now that was a blatant assumption about something of which you have no clue. In my humblest opinion, you have lost the meager credibility to which you were so desperately clinging because you have spouted your assumption as an absolute truth. Although deeply insulted, all I'll say on this subject is that I lost the lottery, I lost some friends, and I lost some family. Congress lost that war like they tried to loose in Iraq. Dayum Dimocrats and their foolish supporters.

I can say I am not a terrorist, but I belive at any cost I would not want my rights violated by some sicko getting his kicks and jerking off if I decided to have phone sex with my husband.....Because that is my right..................
if my line was to be wire tapped. what would you call it?
you seem to use words very lightly, speaking of credibility all I have read from you is words assumptions with know meaning.
Just what are you tring to say?

[2xR]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunachic I can say I am not a terrorist, but I belive at any cost I would not want my rights violated by some sicko getting his kicks and jerking off if I decided to have phone sex with my husband.....Because that is my right.................. if my line was to be wire tapped. what would you call it?

That would be a crime, in more ways than one. You sound a little paraniod.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunachic you seem to use words very lightly, speaking of credibility all I have read from you is words assumptions with know meaning. Just what are you tring to say?

Wow! Try that again. You lost me.

[lunachic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by two-timer (2xR) That would be a crime, in more ways than one. You sound a little paraniod. Wow! Try that again. You lost me.

How do u figure, get a grip. paranoid, lol I don't think so.
and I belive wire tap with out probable cause and know warrent is not admissable in a court of law.Try what again Reb and freightmaster still have the right to speak what they belive. who are you to question that.
or can you disprove it with more then just words?
any how I'm tired so ...........................
peace

[ronin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunachic sorry to hear about ur son, hope all goes well for him. yea, I have real bad feeling's for lawyers.

Same here - in fact, I'm writing a book about the corruption, manipulation, and sexual deviance of this lawfirm...

My son is doing great - he was diagnosed right after his 16th birthday. He's now 22, a technician at a large private shop, graduated UTI with honors, and is engaged and house-hunting.

[ronin]

Some seem to be under the blanket assumption that because the FBI and CIA can track terrorists through the phones, when needed, that somehow they're monitoring every call you make to your Aunt Ethel. Please....

[rebel]

Uh, hey maybe you haven't heard but the telecommunication companies admitted under oath to Congress last week that they had not only listened but recorded millions of law-abiding citizens ph. calls and turned them over to gov. to sift thru. Can you say 4th amendment? This isn't wacko consp. theory - it really happened. Verified under oath. By regular businessmen, not ploiticos or media.

I hate to tell you but that's not oatmeal they've been feeding you.

And exactly how can I prove a 4th amendment violation when W and Cheney are using executive privilege to block FOI petitions? If they hold the evidence do ya think they are just gonna show me?

As far as being a terrorist - think what you want, I guess we do need to pat down grandma in the airport. After all they could be everywhere. I'm so glad George Orwell warned us ahead of time so I would understand what's happening now.

I dunno. Would King George III have accused George Washington of being a terrorist? Hmmm....

I guess I'm in good company - how bout you?